Just had the shit kicked out of me
It's a bit off topic but for those who haven't had their COVID vaccinations I thought I'd share my real world experience regarding side effects. I'm 48 and pretty fit and healthy (or so I thought). Had my fist Pfizer dose three weeks ago with no real side effects apart from a sore arm. Went in yesterday for round two and I woke up at one o'clock this morning freezing my tits off and shaking uncontrollably (This is definitely not normal for living in the Torres Straights). Had a hotter than hell shower for a half hour with all of the doors n windows closed in my bathroom and was still freezing afterwards. Tried using last nights towel to dry myself and it felt like it was liquid ice, switched to a dry towel and managed to get myself dry with chattering teeth and uncontrollable shaking. Hopped into bed with a doona ( definetly not normal ) and managed to get warm and get to sleep. Woke up an hour later soaked to the bone and feeling like I was on fire. Managed to get back to sleep and woke up this morning feeling like I've just met Marsellus Wallace's friends with the blowtorch and a pair of pliers. Every single joint and muscle in my body is absolutely munted and I'm hurting in places that I didn't even know that existed. Looks like a day on the couch with plenty of Netflix coming my way. Interesting thing is my wife had the Astra Zeneca jab and she got flattened by the first dose and felt okay with the second. Just be prepared when you get whacked to have some downtime available to get your back on track. Now if I can just get my dog to get the remote for me all will be good....
My wife understands why I clean my rods n reels in the shower....
Dale
Posts: 7930
Date Joined: 13/09/05
I’m giving it a wide berth, my immune system is pretty stuffed at present. Not ready to be a new statistic for the wrong reasons.
"Just because you are a Character, Doesn't mean you have Character."
Mr Wolf
out wide
Posts: 1535
Date Joined: 30/12/08
Results so far this year 2021 in Australia
Deaths from covid....Nil
Deaths from vaccines...Two
Go figure. And im not interested in B/S charts from overseas its in this country that matters to me.
Take ppl over 80 out of the equation then you would see the numbers plumit to all but bugger all.
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8148
Date Joined: 07/05/12
Newsflash.Disease is
Newsflash.
Disease is treatable if the medical system can cope with the small number of cases resulting in admission...
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
uncle
Posts: 9486
Date Joined: 10/02/07
You may need to be a refugee
to get a bed though, spent a lot of time in hospital lately but not a problem if your private
all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
timboon
Posts: 2957
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Some very good points made
Some very good points made on both sides here....
Makes for some interesting reading....
I find it very scary covid being so new that it is only just beggining to morph and now there are several variants of the disease around the globe...
Profits aside ( and you better beleive it they will be raking in the cash!! ) I understand vaccines were rushed through because of circumstances in other countries who were too slow to react ( or didn't have the means )....
I think we are very very naive to think that a couple of rounds of vaccine and walla we'll be jumping back on a plane going to Bali next winter again...
I think a more probable scenario is that this virus mutates a few more times proving the current vaccines useless and the next bout could be far more severe....
I'm certainly not fear mongering here, thats not my intention....
Fortunately we live in a country where we get a choice and for the most part have the ability to do our own research...
My missus had the shot, I DEF wont be having the shot.....
Each to their own, DYOR
Faulkner Family
Posts: 18036
Date Joined: 11/03/08
I just booked in for the jab
I just booked in for the jab and so has Sandy. Staying where I am in hedland people come from all over the place . I can't afford to get it or pass it on to my wife or mum .
RUSS and SANDY. A family that fishes together stays together
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
Zero Australian Covid19 Deaths
In the press conference by the Health Minister yesterday, he acknowledged that Australia has had 0 deaths in total from Covid19 cases contracted in Australia.
Every one of our 910 deaths were infected outside of Australia.
I guess I should review the risk analysis that I have previously posted.
The chances of dying of Covid19 in Australia for the past 18 months using official data is 0 for all age groups.
(And meanwhile, from the latest TGA weekly report "To 13 June 2021, we received 303 reports of death following vaccination for COVID-19 vaccines.")
sealure
Posts: 115
Date Joined: 19/05/12
You either carelessly or
You either carelessly or deliberately misuse TGA reported information.
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
That's what TGA do
That quote is straight from the weekly TGA Report. Last report I read as stated previously in this thread was 272 reported deaths.
And being careless or deliberately misusing information is what the TGA do.
They have banned successful Covid19 treatments in Australia, such as Hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin (and others) in order to justify their provisional approval of vaccines that have not successfully completed clinical trials and studies.
And they only call it "provisional" so they can mislead the public by saying no, they haven't approved it for Emergency use only, which has a more negative feel to it.
Never mind their adverse reactions stats they report are so much less than what is actually happening out there.
They report that there are just 5 adverse events (reported) per 1000 doses.
And the most common reactions (reported) are headache, fever, muscle pain, chills, nausea and lethargy.
There are about 7 adverse reactions reported just in this thread that only has about 40 fishwrecked users commenting and less than 15 or so have had the vaccine, so anybody who thinks TGA's 5 out of 1000 doses is accurate is beyond my help or influence.
That is, what I post isn't for you ... I understand that, given your dismissive reply that lacks any reason.
Reefsta
Posts: 321
Date Joined: 03/08/19
locally acquired deaths
I feel you earlier post about no locally acquired deaths from Covid versus 2 from vaccines is misleading. The lack of such deaths in the last 18 months stems fomr robust contrls to contain or avoid local outbreaks. However, prior to that good control Victoria had a big outbreak. Here are the numbers for local verus internally acquired in Victoria (19,514 versus 1,169, see pasted table data below)) from the following website; https://covidlive.com.au/ . Victoria had 820 deaths, with the overwhelming majority from locally acquired Covid.
STATELOCAL VARNETOSEASVAR2NET2 Victoria19,514 1,169So we can either stay in permanent isolaiton and hope we avoid Covi outbreak, or get vaccinated and try and resume more normal lives and business activity.
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
I agree
My mistake is wrongly believing the word of the Federal Health Minister when he said during his most recent press conference "Whilst the world has agonizingly lost over 2 million souls to covid, there have been no people in Australia who have caught covid and passed away.".
I have no idea why he said that. It is pretty clear and unambiguous in the way he said it.
I can't seem to edit that previous post where I reference that 0 Australia deaths. But I agree that it does seem improbable. Because I couldn't find data that actually tells you how many locally aquired died and how many returning overseas died, I ran with it.
That data source you have doesn't break down where the deaths have come from. But it is fair and probable that they didn't all come from overseas. You have assumed the part where you say "the overwhelming majority from locally aquired Covid." ... I think it's a fair assumption, but an assumption all the same.
Reefsta
Posts: 321
Date Joined: 03/08/19
Fact not assumption
A Simo says, time to drop this nonsense and think about fishing. Last reply from me.
Given 655 of the 820 Covid deaths (80% of the deaths) in Victoria were in residential care, thats all locally acquired. Even without tallying up the circumstances of the remaining 165 deaths, it is clear that the overwhelming majority of Covid deaths in Victoria (820 deaths) and Australia overall (910 deaths) have come from locally acquired transmission. Hence we don't want that scenario to repeat itself and vaccination offers the prospect of a return to more normal life, without the same level of carnage we've seen when Covid is able to spread throughtout a community. Source of the residential care data is the Australian Governbment Department of Health here;
https://www.health.gov.au/resources/covid-19-cases-in-aged-care-services-residential-care
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
You're right the Health Minister was wrong
I made the mistake of thinking the Federal Health Minister knew something about Australia's Covid19 deaths.
Obviously he was wrong, and I made the mistake of believing him.
Shame on me, lesson learnt, I won't believe him next time I hear him speak.
So now that you have correctly found one fact (I, ... or more accurately) the Health Minister was wrong on, I revert back to my numerous posts statistically showing why getting the vaccine now is a poor choice given analysis of both Covid19 and Covid19 vaccine risks.
Have you seen any of the videos of Dr. Robert Malone (inventor of mRNA vaccine technology) and Mr Steve Kirsch (serial entrepeneur) who have both had the Moderna shots and are now strong advocates of raising awareness of the dangers of the Covid19 vaccines. Kirsch got his three daughters vaccinated early on and is now sorry he did so, due to the risks he understands of possible future fertility issues he believes they have.
And even if these well educated and well researched guys are all eventually shown to be wrong and vaccines are proven with time that they are safe, the questions will still remain as to why good life saving Covid19 treatments like Ivermectin (Hydroxychloroquine, fluvoxamine, steriods, and others) are banned by the same authorities telling us that the vaccines are our only hope of returning to normal life.
And why are victims of vaccines being censored and suppressed to have no voice.
Why did Facebook delete a group ("Covid19 Vaccine Victims and Families") with 120k followers after just one month of being established in March?
Learn from my mistake, don't listen to the Health Minister. Do your own research.
sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Have you had a few whiskeys
Have you had a few whiskeys tonight? I hope so.
Love the West!
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
Have you
I'm not the one believing the fear mongering and thinking about taking some experimental Josef Mengele juice because I'm too scared of a less than 1 in a million chance of being killed by a cold. I'll leave the nerve calming whiskey for those who need it most ... the likes of yourself.
sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Wow! Calm down Freddy it was
Wow! Calm down Freddy it was a bit of humour. There's no fear mongering just a common sense approach, I can't see how you fail to see that when literally all the medical profession in the world does. Anyway let's agree to disagree otherwise this will spiral into idiocy if it hasn't already done so.
Love the West!
Silver Fox
Posts: 1113
Date Joined: 19/06/14
Wow
There's no fear mongering involved. The government and all of the health departments in every state are doing the best they can, and that is an awesome job. Maybe you should take your unvaccinated ass to India and see how you go.
My wife understands why I clean my rods n reels in the shower....
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
Yeah OK
No fear mongering ... and then you tell me to go to India.
You do realise that India does not even rank in the top50 countries for Covid19 deaths per population.
And they are currently trending downwards because they are open to using Hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin as treatments and prophylactics.
They did a considerable sized study that showed ivermectin was 83% effective as a prophylactic (cost of a 2 dose, months treatment is less than $1)
(Other studies I've seen include a Mexico City study showing a 50-76% reduction in hospital visits by Covid19 patients given Ivermectin as home treatment and 74% reduction in deaths in a Peru treatment study).
But then that's not the fear mongering news you get to see on your normal Mainstream Media or Facistbook.
sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Side effects, lovely.Side
Side effects, lovely.
Side effects and risksSide effects aren't common. However, in some people hydroxychloroquine can cause:
There's a small risk that hydroxychloroquine can damage a part of the inside of the eye called the retina. And this increases with long-term use and higher dosage.
Your doctor will advise you on a safe dose to take according to your weight, and you will need to have regular monitoring of your eyes.
This monitoring of your eyes may be arranged at a hospital clinic when you start the drug and then again once a year in a hospital when you have been taking the drug for more than five years.
Otherwise, you should have a check up with an optician once a year and tell them that you're taking hydroxychloroquine
Love the West!
sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
And......One larger
And......One larger randomised clinical trial was published in March 2021. This showed no effect of ivermectin on duration of symptoms of adults with mild COVID-19. The authors stated that the findings did not support the use of ivermectin in these patients, but again highlighted that larger trials were needed to determine whether the drug had other benefits.
Why isn’t it recommended?While some other studies did appear to show benefits of ivermectin, many did not. These were summarised by the National Institutes of Health, showing severe limitations arising from small sample sizes and problems with study design.
Both the National Institutes of Health and the European Medicines Agency judged, on the basis of these studies, that there is currently insufficient evidence to support the use of ivermectin in treatment of COVID-19.
More studies are underway. A large, multicentre trial began in February to determine the effectiveness of ivermectin as well as metformin (an anti-diabetes medication) and fluvoxamine (an antidepressant) in preventing COVID-19 disease progression.
It would therefore be premature to conclude absolutely that ivermectin has no place in COVID-19 treatment. On the basis of current evidence, however, its use cannot be recommended.
You advocate these with little research obviously having being done, but bag vaccines that have been researched and approved by the TGA. Scratch my head there.
Love the West!
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
You just don't get it
WHO, CDC, TGA ... they are all heavily funded and supported by the Bill Gates Foundation.
Hydroxychloroquine has been safely used as a cheap Malaria drug for decades and the second Trump shines the light on it as a possible treatment, the MSM and Gates's medical buddies all suddenly scream that it isn't safe.
Clive Palmer went and bought 30million doses of HCQ for Australians, understanding how good it was at both treating Covid19 (with a suitable Zinc protocol) and as a safe and cheap prophylactic.
What did our Health Department do ... they banned the use of it?
And not only banned it, they actively went after Australian GPs who tried to prescibe it.
And then our trusted media started printing articles about how Trump's irresponsible comments about Hydroxychloroquine had caused a run-on for the drug and now Australian patients who rely on it for non-Covid19 illnesses couldn't get hold of it ... all while Palmer's 30million doses are being held by the Federal Health department under lock and key.
When you go straight for the MSM propaganda on these topics, it demonstrates to me your severe lack of understanding on these topics.
I'm surprised you didn't quote the Lancet study demonising Hydroxychloroquine that all the Media used ... which later had to be retracted when Lancet asked the authors for their data and realised the study was fake and sponsored by some very dodgy businessmen. Funny that hey.
sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Ha ha yeah okClive Palmer ha
Ha ha yeah ok
Clive Palmer ha ha ha well anything he does is to line his pockets , fuck over his employees and this lovely state you live in that's virtually COVID free.
Trump shined a light on he sure did lol My last comment on this thread, so I'll just leave this here
Love the West!
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
Reuters says you're gullible ... do you believe them?
Thanks for the laughs. Now you are having to show another reuters film clip of Trump, because you think that's an easy cheap shot win ... but you only highlight just how gullible you have been and a victim of MSM propaganda once again.
Trump mentioned two things, a disenfectant and use of UV light ... both of which were possibly viable, but not well known.
When you go camping and you want drinking water ... what do you do? You put chemical disinfectants in your water to kill the bacteria before you drink it. You do understand the water you drink out of your tap has disenfectant in it?
There is a very cheap product called MMS (a disenfectant type solution) which has been very successfully used to treat Malaria in poorer countries for decades. And of course that too was demonised by the FDA and the Trump hating media soon after.
And regarding UV light ... China use it to disenfect buses and when Trump said this, there was a US BioTech public company that had videos promoting a product they were developing where they could put a UV light down the esophogus of a patient and disenfect.
"A Cedars-Sinai research team is in the pre-clinical stages of developing a technology that harnesses intermittent ultraviolet (UV) A light for treating viruses and bacteria. The technology has not been tested or used on patients. Cedars-Sinai has filed for patents related to the technology and has signed a licensing agreement with Aytu BioScience with the aim of potentially enabling near-term use as a COVID-19 intervention for critically ill, intubated patients." April 2020.
Youtube promptly deleted the public companies youtube channel when Trump supporters pointed it out to the gullible reuters type brainwashed sheeple.
Reefsta
Posts: 321
Date Joined: 03/08/19
Last gasp
I try to remain objective and avoid propaganda, except when describing what I've caught. Ditto conspiracy theories.
The Lancet is a credible international journal, that seeks to maintain high standards relating to the conduct, reporting and ethics of medical studies. That study you refererred to was pulled one month after it was published, when the independent reviewers subsequently found the authors would not provide all their data so the large dataset analyses could be fully checked. Concerns were also raised about commercial conflicts of interest among some of the authors. The retraction was no doubt embarrassing for the Lancet, but did demonstate that the protocols to maintain high standards were effective, in the end. The Lancet has subsequently put additional reviewing checks in place for medical studies that draw on these types of large datasets.
Putting that Lancet publication aside, a subsequent review of hydroxychloroquininne studies, published in a different international journal in January this year, found the two largest randomized controlled trials to date both confirmed that CQ/HCQ regimen does not provide any clinical benefit for COVID-19 patients. The authors where not those in the Lancet study, seeming to be mostly from the middle east, but some have affilicaiotns with Australia and the UK. They took no money for the study and declared no conflicts of interest. Here is a link to that publication;
https://www.dovepress.com/chloroquine-and-hydroxychloroquine-for-the-prevention-and-treatment-of-peer-reviewed-fulltext-article-TCRM
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
That Study had no zinc
Proponents of HCQ as a Covid19 treatment used it with a protocol of Zinc (or Zinc type supplement/medication plus an antibiotic, typically azithromycin).
In my post that you replied to I said with Zinc and you provide a study without Zinc.
From memory it is the Zinc that really kills Covid19 but the Hydroxychloroquine allows the cells to absorb the zinc better ... or something like that, it's been a while since I learnt about this one.
For example, here's the first study I found when searching for HCQ with Zinc;
(in which 2.8% of the treated Covid19 outpatients ended up hospitalised, while 15.4% of the control group did)
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924857920304258
You need to understand that my position is there is big money (Pfizer / Gates $100bn in future Covid19 vaccine sales) at stake and if it was discovered that a safe and inexpensive treatment like HCQ (or Ivermectin or Vitamin D) was effective (even 50% effective) then it would be much more difficult for the FDA to justify Emergency approval of experimental vaccines. Reports say Gates has poured an estimated $1bn in to Covid19 vaccines and $250million towards advertising, media and lobbying.
Cripes just this week there was an Israel study that shows 26% of Covid19 hospitalised patients deficient in Vitamin D died, while just 3% of the others died.
Meanwhile, I listened to another podcast where a US GP was trying to get some refined Vitamin D prepared by a chemist company and was told that the FDA had banned that too.
Because I can't get HCQ, I have stayed dosed up with Tonic Water (contains quinine) and take zinc, get plenty of sunshine and haven't had even a sniffle for a over a year now.
You can hate my arguments about nefarious global players relating to Covid19 and vaccines, but at least take some note of the possible benefits of supplements like D, C, Iodine, Selenium, ... drink Tonic Water (of course seek your own medical advice ... especially if you like Josef Mengele's juice injected in to you).
Wishing everybody here the best of health and hoping with all my heart that I'm very wrong about the Covid19 vaccines and motives and agendas of others.
Reefsta
Posts: 321
Date Joined: 03/08/19
Zinc
Here's your zinc. Made no difference.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7695238/#
crasny1
Posts: 7003
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Just dont get cinchonism
mate. And rate off severe retinal injury and blindness on HCQ is >> Risk of clots with AZV.
All drugs and treatment have side effect. Azithromycin has, Ivermectin has, HCQ has, and yes Astra and Pfizer has, but it is the risk/benefit ratio.
And as for no deaths as wrongly reported by the minister. You Chose to believe him, but choose to not believe him about vaccines. So you choose what suits your arguement. Hmm - interesting.
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
davewillo
Posts: 2410
Date Joined: 08/09/16
So Crasny - does this mean I
So Crasny - does this mean I have to cut down on my G & T's? Or just use more gin?
PGFC member and lure tragic
crasny1
Posts: 7003
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Use more Gin
LOL. You would seriously have to drink a lot of real tonic water (a lot sold as tonic water hasnt got quinine in it) but it has happened and known.
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8148
Date Joined: 07/05/12
You do know there is an
You do know there is an unequivocal link between 'plenty of sunshine' and melanoma don't you or is that just a government cover up for mobile phone tower radiation?
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
Simo_
Posts: 1843
Date Joined: 13/11/06
You guys need to go do some
You guys need to go do some fishing.
Bring on April
Faulkner Family
Posts: 18036
Date Joined: 11/03/08
My xxl popcorn bucket is
My xxl popcorn bucket is empty. Got any top ups .
Very long winded argument on this topic.
RUSS and SANDY. A family that fishes together stays together
uncle
Posts: 9486
Date Joined: 10/02/07
Yes Russ
but which one has no bias??
all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
Faulkner Family
Posts: 18036
Date Joined: 11/03/08
I have booked to get the
I have booked to get the jab. Should answer the question.
You can read about this stuff all day but in the end everyone has an opinion .
2 things everyone has is an opinion and an asshole , prob is some stink
RUSS and SANDY. A family that fishes together stays together
crasny1
Posts: 7003
Date Joined: 16/10/08
LOL
Love it
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
sealure
Posts: 115
Date Joined: 19/05/12
Hi Russ. Glad I got to meet
Hi Russ. Glad I got to meet you at Coral Bay.
Your comment above is certainly the most accurate & meaningful observation in this whole thread.
Tight lines
Damage82
Posts: 67
Date Joined: 18/04/11
Look...
We just all need to take some safety precorshens...
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8148
Date Joined: 07/05/12
I just had a look to see when
I just had a look to see when appointments may be available and the earliest available appointment is September. Guess that gives me another three months so see if 100% of people who've had it start suddenly dying of organ failure
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
Reefsta
Posts: 321
Date Joined: 03/08/19
Quicker if you want
Get the wait and see approach. However, if you eligible some Pfizer shots are available Pfizer sooner . The online bookings say September the earliest, but if you ring them it is possible to get a booking for a couple of weeks ahead
davewillo
Posts: 2410
Date Joined: 08/09/16
I had decided that I would
I had decided that I would wait to see if they offered Pfizer to over-50's which we all know they have done. I've now booked mine for next Monday.
I've read all of the posts above and I'm no mug but the science is beyond me. One thing I don't understand is if you ignore the Bill Gates and other groups conflict theories, why on earth would the FDA, TGA, world governments and a huge number of medical experts and scientists be part of some whitewash/snowjob/coverup? Makes no sense to me as they have nothing to gain as far as I can see.
Can anyone also tell me if my wife can track me with her phone once the 5G chip goes in on Monday!
PGFC member and lure tragic
little johnny
Posts: 5360
Date Joined: 04/12/11
THE PURGE
. Be lots more fish in ocean / less fishermen
dodgy
Posts: 4578
Date Joined: 01/02/10
And we will all be better
And we will all be better off with the most vulnerable being the ones that are the biggest welfare drag on the country too.
Does anyone know where the love of god goes, when the waves turn the minutes to hours?
crano
Posts: 704
Date Joined: 04/11/09
Three
We need to keep this thread going so the fox can make three pages.
Silver Fox
Posts: 1113
Date Joined: 19/06/14
I agree!.
There has to be a free sticker in it for me........
My wife understands why I clean my rods n reels in the shower....
tot
Posts: 1161
Date Joined: 31/01/10
I have been asking
A lot of customers for their opinion and if they are in a hurry to jabby jab..
Most common reply is they wont untill they are basicaly forced so they can choose which one at that point has been the most succesful.
Can you blame them???
Reverse cycle a/c supply and install - Ducted and wall splits
sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Or like Victoria when
Or like Victoria when there's an outbreak and vaccination centres are overrun, it's laughable at the apathy until they realise what it means when their convenience is under threat.
Love the West!
uncle
Posts: 9486
Date Joined: 10/02/07
Its
done
all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
NORUN NOFUN
Posts: 1035
Date Joined: 15/08/11
I think it's inevitable that
I think it's inevitable that all of us will have the jab, but there is also alot of merit in waiting, you only need to see the farcical rollout of the AZ jab to realise that you need to do your own research before letting someone inject you with a substance that has not been thoroughly tested for long term side effects and for that reason I do not blame people for putting their own health first but ultimately in the end enough people will be vaccinated, the government will open the international gates and for those who choose to remain unvaccinated will ultimately be left to run the gauntlet.
mw87
Posts: 123
Date Joined: 20/07/11
Agree
I agree totally with this. Covid will be part of our community soon enough. Canada have announced a controlled reopening of international borders as of July 5th. My guess is that our government will be watching this closely with intention of doing similar here when we reach a defined percentage of vaccinated population. Soon after there will be another influx of vaccination bookings as those who chose to avoid it now see others admitted to hopspital. Hopefully by then our health infrastrucure has bolstered enough to manage.
The problem with own research is that the internet is inundated with misinformation. One can find themselves in a echo chamber very quickly, believing everyone thinks the same as they do. Media outlet comments are filled with vocal antivaxxers creating a similar effect. However, the fact vaccination clinics are fully booked beyond September indicates not everyone is being sucked in to the online BS from Google professors. I'm in my 30's and can't wait for my appointment in 2 weeks time.
sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Well written logical take on
Well written logical take on it mate
Love the West!
davewillo
Posts: 2410
Date Joined: 08/09/16
I agree with your comments
I agree with your comments MW. As soon as they get outbreaks on the east coast the daily vaccinations go up. If you choose not to get vaccinated, fine - it's your choice. But if you're definitely going to get vaccinated then best to do it sooner rather than later. Having said that I also respect those who choose to wait until later out of concerns with side effects. I am late 50's and was worried about AZ but now I can get Pfizer, I'm booked for Monday. Each to their own.
PGFC member and lure tragic
uncle
Posts: 9486
Date Joined: 10/02/07
Got it at 5pm
Best nights sleep I’ve had for along time
all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
Silver Fox
Posts: 1113
Date Joined: 19/06/14
Side effects
Has anyone had both shots yet and if so which vaccine and did you have any reactions to it?.
My wife understands why I clean my rods n reels in the shower....
SeperateKnob
Posts: 668
Date Joined: 28/11/16
Both my mum and dad have had
Both my mum and dad have had both az shots and experienced zero side effects
Pob
Posts: 356
Date Joined: 13/10/10
My wife has had both of the
My wife has had both of the AZ vaccine, felt crap for a few days after the first shot but absolutely nothing after the second, I was the same after my first so hopefully going to be same when I have my second. We're both 45.
groverwa
Posts: 286
Date Joined: 21/07/14
az
Had my 2nd shot on Tuesday and no side effects with both - in the same arm - cant even see where the injection went in
hezzy
Posts: 1521
Date Joined: 27/11/09
good read all of this so far
good read all of this so far
im no anti vaxxer , mostly had my flu shot every year , did the whooping cough when grandys where born ,,, etc
but with this im also in the ''lets wait camp ''
i make the points
,
1 there is no covid in the south west where i live and has not been for over a year , nor is a large outbreak likly at present
2 i believe at present and into the near future my chances of catching it are almost zero
3 even if i was to get it , my survival is most likely as im not in a high risk group
4 the gov and health information around the various vaccines is new and changing often as it is more widely used updated info comes out
5 there are now and will likly continue to be variants of covid 19 , see point 4 above on how we will need to deal with this over time
6 our hospitals and health system is not coping well at present , well under resourced and understaffed that is real and yet the gov is pissing in the wind scapegoating the st john ambulance group , and other health issues are off the chain in numbers , but get less fearmongering or resources ,, why ?/
7 our health minister and premier , both are misleading the public imo about all of the above day by day, month by month to suit their politics , why would others across the world not do the same ?/
8 even if i have the covid vaccine [any of them ]]i can still catch it and pass it on ??so how is that preventing others from catching it ??
9 again if i do have the vaccine ....how will that affect or allow me to travel if i want to ?? interstate and overseas ??
10 travel insurance ?? if you have had the vaccine and do travel can you get any insurance for travel ?? given its still a rated pandemic ??
11 we live in australia an island nation , so comparing us to other places is pointless imo
12 if i was to have it , and have an adverse reaction that caused an issue there is no indemnity at all as i understand at present ,?/ that alone is a high risk imo
so reflecting on all that above and much more . .its not easy to see that getting a vaccine is the panacea its being made out to be in some quarters
so for now im not and over time ill keep checking and decide as things unfold into the future if i do or not at some point in time
hezzy
OFW 11
evil flourishes when good men do nothing
Billcollector
Posts: 2080
Date Joined: 16/05/09
Summed up my thoughts
Summed up my thoughts exactly Hezzy. I've got more chance of being run over by a caravan up here at the moment than catching covid
.
tot
Posts: 1161
Date Joined: 31/01/10
A good mate of mine has had the virus
He had hardly any symptoms, barely felt anything at all. This was in Bali where he lives. He works fly in fly out and was stuck here for 9 months last year as he had to do a visa run - got the virus on his return back.
Whilst I'm on the fence about which type vaccine is best I do think it's inevitable.
International borders will open when a certain percentage have had the jab. This is happening in countries shortly with set dates for commencement.
Travelsafe alert said in short yesterday for certain travelers that if you've had the two shots OR covid 19 you can go into Singapore without quarantine. This is likely how it will go for us.
No matter where you live in Australia the virus will travel through at some point.
Reverse cycle a/c supply and install - Ducted and wall splits
sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
And that's the logic of the
And that's the logic of the vaccine mate, if you do manage to get COVID you don't get as ill, if ill at all and no need for hospitalisation which then means no overwhelming of our sadly already overwhelmed system. Roger the dodger Cook should have fallen on his sword when the findings of the death of that little girl came out.
Me an the missus want to travel and would even love a trip to Singers it's a great destination, lots of micro brewers there
Love the West!
tot
Posts: 1161
Date Joined: 31/01/10
For sure
I'm onboard for getting it just will wait a little longer to hear which to go for.
I hope Japan is on the radar again come February. Went last year and returned just before we shut down.
edit - and here we go again....
Reverse cycle a/c supply and install - Ducted and wall splits
SeperateKnob
Posts: 668
Date Joined: 28/11/16
From what I've read if you
From what I've read if you get the jab your 25 times less likely to transmit the virus
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
Less than 2 times is closer to the truth.
Studies have shown vaccinated individuals are 40-50% less likely to transmit the virus.
That is a long, long way off 25 times. If you have a source for the 25 times, I would be like to have a read of it.
Those studies showing a 40-50% reduction in transmission, suggest to me that in reality, vaccine effectiveness is not close to their marketed 90+% efficacy.
This is also supported by Israel, who have a large percentage of fully vaccinated population (Pfizer) having breakthrough Covid19 cases recently.
They believe it is due to the Delta variant which Pfizer does not appear to be as effective against.
Faulkner Family
Posts: 18036
Date Joined: 11/03/08
Problem is this virus is
Problem is this virus is not going to go away . Going to be a long term thing I feel. As it mutates it may get stronger and hit a lot harder. I am one that was in w minds about it as I am fairly fit and healthy but others around me aren't so lucky. I have booked in to get the jab to protect others around me more so than myself.
Being in the food transport business I come in contact with people all around. Even tho I am in hedland at present there is a lot of FIFO workers staying where I am.
RUSS and SANDY. A family that fishes together stays together
davewillo
Posts: 2410
Date Joined: 08/09/16
First dose of Pfizer 5G
First dose of Pfizer 5G tomorrow. Maybe good timing booking in when I did given today's news!
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uncle
Posts: 9486
Date Joined: 10/02/07
Jabs will probably
go up now, I’m off for popcorn
all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
uncle
Posts: 9486
Date Joined: 10/02/07
Jabs will probably
go up now, I’m off for popcorn
all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
uncle
Posts: 9486
Date Joined: 10/02/07
Seems you an have clots
or heart problems with the other jabs!!
all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
Sea goat
Posts: 982
Date Joined: 26/03/17
think the last few days is a
think the last few days is a pretty good exampe of why waiting and watching may not be the best approach. things can take off suddenly, and then theres a mad scramble and facilities get overwhelmed.
its almost like relying on everyone else to to the right thing so that you can have reduced risks. fully unerstand if you have health problems etc, but something like this seems to need everyone to get on board.
davewillo
Posts: 2410
Date Joined: 08/09/16
I agree Sea Goat, which is
I agree Sea Goat, which is why I had my first Pfizer/5G yesterday. Booked about 10 days ago and it was a breeze at Claremont Showgrounds. Our experience was my wife went early yesterday morning and it took about an hour and a quarter with big queues. I went at 2.30 yesterday afternoon and was vaccinated within about 15 minutes. You then have to wait 15 minutes to ensure no adverse reactions and then on your way.
I feel fine today but that's pretty normal for first dose of Pfizer. Most people I know of similar age (50's) have been flattened by the first AZ jab but nothing on the second. As we know from the original poster Silver Fox, it's the second dose of Pfizer that may knock you for a six. I'll see in 4 weeks time! I'm going to Broome for a week in late July so I'llleave it until after that to get the second dose.
I respect those who choose not to get the jab or want to wait but I would encourage not waiting too long if we want to get some semblance of our old lives back!
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sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
You are right Dave, knocked
You are right Dave, knocked of my perch after first jab of Astra. Second round in 4 weeks.
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davewillo
Posts: 2410
Date Joined: 08/09/16
Yeah you should be fine with
Yeah you should be fine with the next one Andy.
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boneyman
Posts: 43
Date Joined: 03/02/10
WTF
Great to see the GOP flourishing in WA.
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
Our latest 2021 statistics
For the year 2021 so far, Australia has had 2,102 Covid19 cases resulting in 1 death.
That 1 death was a person in their 80s who was infected in the Phillipines, returned to Australia and passed away in mid April 2021.
That translates to Covid19 infected people in Australia having a less than 0.05% chance of dying ... for all age groups.
Meanwhile, our latest TGA weekly report ... "Since the beginning of the vaccine rollout to 20 June 2021, the TGA has received 318 reports of death in people who have recently been vaccinated.".
That is from a reported 6,590,741 doses.
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8148
Date Joined: 07/05/12
What's even scarier is that
What's even scarier is that 100% of people that have died in Australia in 2021 have been exposed to dihydrogen monoxide to varying degrees.
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sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Lol
Lol
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davewillo
Posts: 2410
Date Joined: 08/09/16
Shit Frosty I had some and a
Shit Frosty I had some and a COVID jab yesterday so I'm clearly fucked!
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Jackfrost80
Posts: 8148
Date Joined: 07/05/12
Tick, tick ,tick
Tick, tick ,tick
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sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Just read on the ABC website
Just read on the ABC website that Indonesia is on the brink of catastrophe, running out of oxygen in most places and where you can get it it's trippled in price.
"Every day we are seeing this Delta variant driving Indonesia closer to the edge of a COVID-19 catastrophe," said Jan Gelfand, head of the Indonesian delegation of the International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies (IFRC).
Reported by the ABC and Rueters
So it's probably not true
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BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
Very Interesting
That's interesting given Indonesia only this week sent 2,000 oxygen cylinders to India, on top of the 1,400 oxygen cylinders and 200 oxygen concentrators sent earlier this year.
And also this ... "JAKARTA: Indonesia’s Health Minister Budi Gunadi Sadikin said on Friday (Jun 25) that more hospitals and beds have been prepared in Jakarta to cope with another surge of COVID-19 cases, while assuring the public that there is sufficient oxygen supply on Java island."
(Source ... NOT the ABC or Reuters ... so it probably is true).
There are estimates that Indonesia has likely had over 10% of their population infected with Covid19. Recent studies have found 15-17% of study populations had evidence of past Covid19 infection.
So far, Indonesia have had about 57k deaths recorded against Covid19 during the past 18 months.
Indonesia has an estimated 100k Tuberculosis deaths per year (some estimates up to 175k). Even with 90+% TB vaccination rates in their children.
sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Nothing to see
Nothing to see here......
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-27/covid19-isolation-deaths-indonesia-patients-hospital/100240430
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davewillo
Posts: 2410
Date Joined: 08/09/16
My bet is that things are a
My bet is that things are a lot worse in Indonesia than we are hearing. Like India and a number of other places, I doubt that the records are that accurate. Yes there will be errors in both directions but the horror stories from these countries are so sad. As has been pointed out ad nauseam, the real issues arise if a healthcare system is overun with people requiring hospitalisation. This has been the case from New York to New Delhi so it isn't unique to developing countries.
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crasny1
Posts: 7003
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Leave it Andy
And just hope and pray he doesnt discover first hand what this virus can do.
A dead horse dont respond to a flogging and despite the best efforts we will NEVER be able to convince some. But at least live and science has a thing called Evolution, where Mother nature will ensure survival of the fittest, and in human's case cleverest.
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
Mr Double Down
Changing goal posts again.
I see your desire is to focus on the fear mongering of Indonesia now ... given Australia's Covid19 statistics are really nothing to see here.
Hospitals around the world operate on 70-80% occupancy in normal times.
Your referenced article tries to make a big issue about 4 provinces being above 80% (Indonesia has 34 provinces) ... that's just another example of your typical MSM propaganda and gaslighting. The Indo health minister only days ago stated that (aside from the Covid19 established hospitals and beds) 60,000 of the countries 85,000 normal hospital beds are occupied (ie. 70.5%).
What the article fails to mention is that Indonesia have established Covid19 referral hospitals with isolation beds where Covid19 patients are directed to and they are of course filling up as Covid19 cases rise. The Indonesian Health Minister also stated that more dedicated Covid19 hospitals and isolation beds were being allocated and prepared to meet demands.
Indonesia has a large number (est 30%) of people living in poor urban slum conditions. About 10% are malnutritioned.
And I'll repeat again, Indonesia have considerable more deaths due to Tuberculosis per year than they are now experiencing with Covid19.
sea-kem
Posts: 15005
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Definitelty flogging a dead
Definitelty flogging a dead horse as far as you're concerned, you don't acknowledge any points just argue them. I guess most of the rest of the world is wrong and you are right. Painful.
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Jackfrost80
Posts: 8148
Date Joined: 07/05/12
Ok let’s play along at home:A
Ok let’s play along at home:
A quick search shows that Indonesia has a population of 276m of which 25.9% (71m) are children. With your quoted TB vaccination rate of 90%, that means that there are 7.1m children in Indonesia that are not vaccinated against TB.
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Jackfrost80
Posts: 8148
Date Joined: 07/05/12
BlueKiaser? A 2.4% death rate
BlueKiaser? A 2.4% death rate for unvaccinated children for a preventable disease is bad isn't it?
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
Total Deaths not Child Deaths.
Indonesia have an estimated 100-175k TB deaths in their total population (child deaths are part of that ... I don't know the age demographics of the deaths).
A study which reviewed many previous BCG vaccine studies found the Effectiveness to be about 50%. But studies also show that this vaccine is more effective the further away from the Equator, thus reducing it's effectiveness in Indonesia.
A little over 70% of the Indonesian population is vaccinated for TB (92.2% of infants 0-2months old), but I have not seen any data that clarifies how many are up to date with their TB shots (the shot does not last a lifetime).
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8148
Date Joined: 07/05/12
Whoah, listen to the
Whoah, listen to the screeching of those brakes. So within the one arguement you have gone from:
"Indonesia has an estimated 100k Tuberculosis deaths per year (some estimates up to 175k). Even with 90+% TB vaccination rates in their children."
to:
"A little over 70% of the Indonesian population is vaccinated for TB"
Talk about cherry picking statistics to suit whatever garbled, incoherent argument you are actually trying to put forward.
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
Calm down and try having an objective read.
You welded together my two sentences and took the discussion down your surmising path which was not what I posted. It was how you misinterpreted my post.
Indonesia have been vaccinating their infants since 1998 (maybe 1999, not sure which it was) with the BCG vaccine in an effort to help them with their TB problems.
That program now sees them vaccinating 92.2% of their infants ... but that doesn't mean the entire population is also at 90+%. It means that with each decade, more and more of the population will be vaccinated for TB.
I tried to clarify that by adding the information about a little over 70%.
TB exists in Indonesia and not in Australia ... not because of the vaccines ... it is because Indonesia is far more overcrowded, poorer, and lower sanitary conditions than us.
The TB topic was raised by me to put the Covid19 deaths in to perspective in a country like Indonesia who have been dealing with a bigger TB problem for years.