Demersal tag system
I may get a flogging for this suggestion, but what the hell, we're not doing too well as it stands. I'm not sure it should be for all of the at risk species, or just Jewies.
I think tag allocation for demersals, where a limited number of tags per season are allocated via a free lottery system may work. Some states in the US do this for deer hunting I gather. You could offer incentives NOT to bid for tags, such as removing boat fishing licence fees. I know a number of dinghy fisherman who aren't interested in catching jewies. That alone will give you a better idea of how many people dont target demersals.
It's easy to police: turn up back at the ramp with an untagged baldie and you're in the shit. At the end of the year you simply complete a return stating you had 'x' unfilled tags. Tags would be simply a numbered, non reusable cable tie. Any relevant species has to have the tag in it until processing.
Make them "not for sale" to eliminate scalpers and good for one year of gazetted fishing seasons. If I was to take my (unlicenced) brother in law out deep for demersals and he gets lucky, then that comes off any tags I have.
There would need to be other considerations, such as the maximum number of tags an individual could posess or whether tags are issued to a boat rego or licence holder. That can be worked out. It ain't going to be perfect, and yes, you will get punters trying to get around the system, but I think it would help better manage fish stocks.
Anyway, feel free to get stuck into me if you think it's a prick of an idea; I'm pretty thick skinned. Regards, John
Da pirate
Posts: 1629
Date Joined: 03/05/15
Dhuies ..
Less confusing .
cheers pirate
scottland
Posts: 3044
Date Joined: 10/05/10
Peopl
People aren't honest enough to avoid the amount of returned catch floating of into the distance. I garuntee the dead baldies and dhuies went up after the legal size was removed.
plus it's a lot easier to not shoot a squirrel whilst chasing a deer ahha
i support two teams eagles and whoever is playing the dockers
Reefsta
Posts: 399
Date Joined: 03/08/19
Number of tags?
It could be effective at controlling catch numbers , but I'm not sure having one or two tags per year would be too exciting. However, maybe that is how things have to go. Just treat a 5kg snapper as a trophy fish and take 1-2 per year for special occasions?
A quick Google search indicated something like 50,000 licenced boat fishers in the Metro area and estimates of recreational catch something like 40 tonnes. If that is anywhere close, then it's less than 1kg/fisher. Given a 50cm pinkie is around 2kg, less than half a legal sized fish per licence.
wrasse magnet
Posts: 129
Date Joined: 16/10/10
The problem with tag system
The problem with tag system for a particular species is you might end up being forced to release a lot of those fish under the tag system while you continue fishing to round out your demersal bag. Before the ban I estimate my metro catches in the 40's were 50% Dhu, 25% Breaksea, 20% Baldie and 5% pinkies. If we had a tag system for Dhus I would have been releasing a lot of Dhus to get to my demersal bag. Science says most of them would have carked it. I disageree with that myself, if you take good care bringing up small fish, particularly over the last 5 meters, and then use a release weight, then more survive than the scientists say. Problem is most people don't so perhaps the scientsis are right. Anyhoo, species tags for fish not practical IMO, per post above you can't selectively hook the target species.
Lefty 44
Posts: 186
Date Joined: 04/12/17
No
Every inch we give we never get back.
Roughas
Posts: 73
Date Joined: 24/08/17
I would suggest, Lefty,
I would suggest, Lefty, that we don't "give" anything; it's more of a case things are just taken. Submissions from fisherfolk are pretty much ignored, other than the predictable lip service.
We (through Recfish?), should be putting as much pressure as possible on the department to tell us what the rules will be when the ban ends, or at least some of the proposals, otherwise it will have been pointless and we end up in the same position we're in now. I don't think they have a clue, although I'm more than happy to be proven wrong.
Lefty 44
Posts: 186
Date Joined: 04/12/17
Recfish
Taken is probably more accurate.
Recfish can learn a lot from the fishing lobby in Victoria.
They have set the standard for fighting for fishing rights (about the only thing Vic has got right).
Local councils paying to improve boat ramps, stocking programs, improved access to areas previously restricted.
And the fishing over there is terrible compared to here.
Brock O
Posts: 3323
Date Joined: 11/01/08
Wouldn't be surprised if a
Wouldn't be surprised if a log system comes in, this compulsory for the boat owners to complete and submit.
Recon its getting to the point were they have that many exclusion zones, seasons, limits and sizes etc plus theres more to come, a full online knowledge learning induction with questionnaire will be required before RFBL can be issued, these specific for the boat owners.
Reefsta
Posts: 399
Date Joined: 03/08/19
Something like the current voluntary one?
Seems likely that there'll be some version of the current voluntary one called FishCatchWA.
www.dpird.wa.gov.au/online-tools/fishcatchwa/
Swompa
Posts: 4034
Date Joined: 14/10/12
Personally, i had no
Personally, i had no problems with an allocation of tags per fisho.
We went out 5 times last year and came home with fish 3 of them. I would be happy with a hand full of tags because having more tags wouldnt make the weather more suitable and wouldnt make me go out more.
I would have no problem having to take a photo with the fish and submit it with the tag allocated to that fish. Once its gone, its gone.
This would gather the data that fisheries want and allow them to conduct real science.
Reefsta
Posts: 399
Date Joined: 03/08/19
Shark Bay example
A quick online search indicates a mandatory tag system was used from 2003-2015 to help the Shark Bay snapper recover. A set number of tags was were issued via a lottery, with a limit of two tags per person per year. After 2016, when the stock seemed recovered, things switched back to bag and possession limits.
uncle
Posts: 9636
Date Joined: 10/02/07
Sounds good
Swompa
all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
Faulkner Family
Posts: 18287
Date Joined: 11/03/08
Personally I think they
Personally I think they stuffed it up when they changed it from 2 fish per angler and only 2 dhuies per boat. Should have stayed that way . It was generally hard enough at times to get that . Long goes the days where you could take 2 or 3 and sometimes more out for the day and come home with a feed for all until next trip out. 4 fish per boat was a joke especially when you could get 4 dhuie in that . I feel nothing will be what it was. Yeah I am in the pilbara at the moment but won't be forever.
The north west is going to get a flogging over the next couple of years and then the shit will hit the fan there as well.
RUSS and SANDY. A family that fishes together stays together
Rob H
Posts: 5898
Date Joined: 18/01/12
Not by recs it wont.At the
Not by recs it wont.
At the moment 96% of the effort is commercial there.
How much of that ground out to the 100 meter line ever gets touched by a rec hook?
Its 50 plus miles out with minimal launch points for large capable boats
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Faulkner Family
Posts: 18287
Date Joined: 11/03/08
The area I was talking about
The area I was talking about was more from carnarvon through to exmouth. Your right about distance for deep water further up. We have been out as far as 30nm and still only in the high 20,s out from Hedland . We're giving coral bay a miss this year (first time in many years) going point Samson instead. Bit closer to home. If productive we could even do the odd weekend trip down
RUSS and SANDY. A family that fishes together stays together
Reefsta
Posts: 399
Date Joined: 03/08/19
Lower northwest
Seems likely a bit more rec pressure would go to Ningaloo, particularly the Coral Bay to Exmouth section, but north of the Murions the shelf gets much wider and easy access for trailer boats gets pretty thin on the ground except around the coastal towns.
wifecallsmegrumpy
Posts: 159
Date Joined: 09/01/12
A tag system only works
A tag system only works when you can release fish unharmed. The scientists are convinced that the barotrauma and fish handling results in the majority of caught fish dying, therefore as others here have pointed out a tag system won't work as people catch smaller dhu's release them and wait for the 15+kg Dhu to use their tag. Even once you use your Dhu tag you will continue to have them as By-Catch when fishing for Snapper etc.
Tag system works for Deer where you can see the Deer before you shoot it, but unfortunately not a perfect solution for Dhu's
It stinks but I can see how they ended up with the ban as the ultimate option to protect the fish, my guess is that the fishery won't reopen on time as a few years won't repopulatate the region.
Swompa
Posts: 4034
Date Joined: 14/10/12
I may be entirely wrong
I may be entirely wrong here, but I have travelled many thousands of nautical miles on the ocean and have never, ever seen a dead and floating demersal.
If so many demersal fish end up with barotrauma and floating after being released, wouldnt we be coming across them every so often?
Billcollector
Posts: 2123
Date Joined: 16/05/09
Not with the amount of
Not with the amount of sharks out there, easy feed.
hezzy
Posts: 1531
Date Joined: 27/11/09
ok ... TAGS .. im in the
ok ... TAGS ..
im in the absolute no camp on tags ...,, beware of getting what you think you want on tags
so many problems from a practical and administrative point of view
1st ,, there are currently too many fishing from boat licences to even issue one tag per licence per year if you want to stay within the current TAC ,,
so that might mean you then get the dept to create a demersal only licence , which if they did and say 25000 where sold , then you might get i tag issued per year to catch 1 dhuie .. if that one per licence caught averages at say 7kg ,, then you have taken in theory 175 ton of dhuie ,, which is again way over the current TAC to get the dhuis to recover
2 if you get the dept issueing tags for dhuis , then it will only be a matter of time before they move other fish species onto a tag system ,, so all other demersals or pelagics , salmon , herring crays whiting , squid even crabs could over 10-20 years be covered by tags ,,, all different colours etc for different species all for the rec fishers to keep organised onboard the boat every time you go out and need them ,,if you dont take a certain tag species then you cant keep it if its abycatch ,, your putting it back ,, so you really will need to keep them all onboard , from 8 metre boays down to 3.6 metre tinnies .just in case so you wont cop a fine ,,
3 most people buy a licence online ,, so how will the tags come ? and when ?/via the post ? via temu , etsy or ? most fisheries offices are now closed to public or only open on working days , so there not likly to be apick up point if the local offices will even carry them
4 anyone who recalls the tags for shark bay snapper over the ten years will know they issued i think 500 tags per year in alottery type system ,, so only a small few fishios got a tag or 2 tags ... most who entered got none ,, no tag no fishing in that zone for that species ,given growth in wa population pushing up towards 4 million in near future ,expect the pressure on certain species if under atag system to be same methodology ,, even crabs or squid ,,,
5 compliance ,, to make it work there will need to be more officersa t ramps checking , so licence admin costs for tags etc will go up , expect more individual licences for tagged species to cover that , once the info from tags is in , expect shorter seasons for access to that licence or species .. fines will need to be sizable to motivate people to do the right thing ,,
6 an element of fishers will if they only have one or 2 tags max per year upgrade to get the biggest for their tag to be used ,, so dhuis mortality will likly increase as aby product of tags ....as will other species if yuo only get 6pinkies and 4 baldies per year per licence ..etc etc ..
there are other issues but i think you get the drift ... imo unless you like making your fishing and life on the water more complicated and stressfull avoid tags
its sound good in theory , but moveing to that type of system imo will reduce your fishing time and catch immmensely right across the board .......
feel free to fire away ...cheers hezzy
OFW 11
evil flourishes when good men do nothing
Reefsta
Posts: 399
Date Joined: 03/08/19
Too true
All those points ring true. The only demersals I chase occasionally are pink snapper inshore <15m. Once the fishery opens it needs to be managed with rules as simple as possible. I'd much rather have a fish per trip rule, along with online catch reporting, than 1 tag a year I've got to keep track of, or another licence. We already have more licences and higher licence fees than the rest of the country.
Billcollector
Posts: 2123
Date Joined: 16/05/09
As alway you have summed it
As alway you have summed it up very well Hezzy.
squidvicious1
Posts: 848
Date Joined: 22/07/10
yep hezzys on point/ not
yep hezzys on point/ not enuff rangers to police it,license fees will go up to fund them.
squidvicious1
Posts: 848
Date Joined: 22/07/10
yep hezzys on point/ not
yep hezzys on point/ not enuff rangers to police it,license fees will go up to fund them.
squidvicious1
Posts: 848
Date Joined: 22/07/10
yep hezzys on point/ not
yep hezzys on point/ not enuff rangers to police it,license fees will go up to fund them.