Bring on the drum lines! Too many sharks in WA


hezzy's picture

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[there is one thing i

Wed, 2014-10-08 12:37

[there is one thing i disagree with hezzy and that is your reproductive calculations. there is almost no recorded evidence of mating and birth of great whites. mating has been seen only a handful of times, less than ten pregnant females have ever been disected and a live birth has never been witnessed by anyone with the right credentials. their breeding habits are still almost completely unknown.]
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fausto , my calculations where as i stated hypothetical , it was just an exercise to show how the numbers could easily be rising

read these links below about gw juveniles , wether mating or birth is recorded is not the issue there is plenty of evidence of juvenile gw sharks if you look

http://www.theherald.com.au/story/2027804/great-white-shark-nursery-off-hunter-coast/

http://www.australiangeographic.com.au/topics/wildlife/2011/12/great-white-shark-nursery/

http://www.csiro.au/Outcomes/Oceans/Marine-Life/CSIRO-shark-research-index/Shark-tracking.aspx

no one is narky with the scientists , read my posts i think we need tagging , however im not against the removal of GW that are potential risks to humans either

GW as adults mainly feed on mammals , whales seals etc , guess what humans are ??
whale and seal populations are rising , lots of stats on that as well , the large GW are here in higher abundance & for longer because imho their food source is here to match , yes more humans are in the water of our coast , but the frequency of encounters is definitly on the increase

hezzy

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 "yes more humans are in the

Wed, 2014-10-08 16:59

 "yes more humans are in the water of our coast , but the frequency of encounters is definitly on the increase"

exactly, because more people are in the water.

i do not disagree with your comments though. it may be you are correct but from what ive seen and heard seals are struggling to find food and their numbers are going down. not sure about whales. in temrs of the other things you said i am not too sure myself so i can't really comment.

people do get narky with scientist. obviously not yourself, you seem to have a brain in your head but a lot of other people dont and just class everyone who is against shark culls as hippies.

as for the hypothetical calculations that is exactly my point. everything to do with shark numbers is pretty much hypothetical. there is so little known about them.

thanks for the mature discussion though, i take all of your points seriously and do not disagree with you. i just cannot agree either though.

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Give me a fish and I will eat for a day, teach me to fish and I will starve to death.

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 anecdotal evidence

Wed, 2014-10-08 12:38

 anecdotal evidence

I have been at sea almost all my working life including about 16 years as skipper of tuna longlining, shark fishing, cray, whale/manta tours, charter fishing plus as much or more time at the Abrolhos than most here.

I have never seen a great white shark in the flesh other than Vic Hislops display in Queensland.

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hezzy's picture

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rob h your not an orphan in

Wed, 2014-10-08 18:52

rob h your not an orphan in that regard im sure

fausto ,

there are more whales of the wa coast now than ever before , their numbers are increasing , that is a fact

there are seal colonys all along the coast with their numbers slowly rising as well

anecdotal evidence ?? in the mid 70s there where no seals at south point Cowaramup bay , nor bunkers bay , now there is an established colony at both places

to my mind it is logical to believe that with the combination of higher whale numbers migrating along our coast & more seals , there would be reason to think the wa coast is providing a greater source of food for GW than ever before in the last 80 years, &the GW whe they do come to wa they are staying in our coastal waters for longer periods

now combined with an increase of human activity along the coast & humans are mammal we look like pinnipeds when we swim , of course those GW that are here in higher numbers will start to take an interst in us , from under the water a seal or surfer are not that dissimilar imho

add in cage diving , GW are migratory , so we;ve been conditioning them now for over 20 years with cage diving to come to burley and dive type boats , is it any surprise they are doing it when they come across boats ,anywhere more frequently ??

all of this is also highly dependant on the individual GW condition at each individual interaction with us in the ocean ,

why do they attack one person and not another ?/
why do they spy hop like whales ?
why do they migrate from one place to another over many years in what seems to be cyclical routes ?

I don't believe it is by accident or mistake they are smart enough to survive as an apex predator , they can adapt & learn imo also & we are assisting with that

hezzy

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OFW 11

evil flourishes when good men do nothing

 

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 I do mean it as in that I

Wed, 2014-10-08 19:09

 I do mean it as in that I know/believe they are there and way more than before, just that so far they have stayed away from me!

Poddys GW video 2 years ago was shot directly out the front of my house a couple of miles 

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 Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...

 

 

The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.

Everyone's just winging it.

 

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Date Joined: 10/02/14

i agree with you completely

Thu, 2014-10-09 10:02

i agree with you completely on the cage diving. just wondering if it is possible they are hanging around here because of increases like you say and decreases in other parts of the world. the fact they are adaptive is well known. which is why they breach in deeper waters in SA and stalk over here. that is all learned behaviour. i still just think not enough is known about them and humans cause enough devastation around the world. just like that development set for peron. i think it should be left alone. some people here might strongly disagree, but theres not much metro stuff left which has been left untouched. wont be long till places like wilbinga will have marinas and beach side developments and the people who like to disappear for a while will have nowhere private left to go to.

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Give me a fish and I will eat for a day, teach me to fish and I will starve to death.

little johnny's picture

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no one wins

Wed, 2014-10-08 19:58

in this one ,I don't like them to much.same arguement every year, no action will be taken against them(big whites),after reading paper death threats to fisheries is wrong ,if a big white is hanging around in close to shore for days on end ,(school holidays also) good on them. this thread happens every year,we wont solve it.there is a heap of big sharks now days in close (due to increase in pink schools),only my thoughts on matter . bigger schools of fish ,bigger number of sharks chasing them.good for stocks ,bad for people who use water as rec sport.

carnarvonite's picture

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Whale numbers

Thu, 2014-10-09 07:33

As others have stated, since the numbers of whales have increased so have the sightings of white pointers, once more food is available they soon learn to show up at feeding time. You only need to see footage at Whale world at Albany from when the whaling station was still running, I was lucky enough to put up with the pong and see it for real.

Over the years as a pro fisherman , I have seen and caught quite a few, sadly having to cut them out of the net or line when they were dead rather than risk a $10.000 fine.

The next couple of months is when the numbers are going to increase with the whales heading south again with new calves in tow for the first time, easy meat for whites and killer whales.

woody's picture

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Change of topic

Thu, 2014-10-09 19:47

Change of topic slightly....but do you know the thing that sickens me the most out of all that's happened to Sean Pollard? He is recovering in hospital after multiple operations and receiving friggen HATE mail from friggen Greenies!!!! Saying how its all his fault that 2 x GWs got killed for nothing!!
His poor Mum is by his side screening his mail so he doesn't have to read this shit

WTF is the world coming too!!

little johnny's picture

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yep that is crap

Thu, 2014-10-09 20:42

95% off the people protecting them don't even use the ocean ,as if the family isn't going through enough without crap mail,100% agree woody ,what is the world coming to,funny thing is I had a lovely lady abusing the sh-t out off me at traffic lights while heading to ramp with boat on ,screaming poluter poluter poluter,I shook my head and thought I wonder what she wipes her back side with,surely not toilet paper.then I thought I wonder what she eats and drinks,then I said a few nice parting words,how can anyone doing what they love be at blame, sad world,said many times before(and yes I have bitten once again) if a croc kills someone,dead, if your pet dog attacks someone protecting your property dead,wtf is wrong with the world ,100% agree woody and I feel for the young fit lad with the world ahead of him.hope he has a full recovery,they have been protected to long in my books,

chris raff's picture

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 There’s a few sick puppies

Fri, 2014-10-10 07:28

 There’s a few sick puppies out there ..  I would’ve thought the activists would prioritise consoling and befriending the victims family in order to have their views endorsed or at least not opposed .

Such as this “ Natalie Banks,founder of the No WA Shark Cull campaign, has also launched an Indiegogo fundraiser for Mr Pollard, so far raising more than $6000." 
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timboon's picture

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A worrying trend for me seems

Fri, 2014-10-10 06:58

A worrying trend for me seems to be the double teaming of these sharks.

The skurfer off west beach in Adelaide was taken by the bigger shark but two were present.

Brad Smith at Lefties was "apparently" hit by two sharks

This fella down in Esperance and my night shift brain isn't so sharp but from memory there was another that was a tag team effort apparently on the Whites behalf. Might have been the one at Bunkers??

You would think they would be like any other species in the ocean where its survival of the fittest. If you have two sharks bypass a human perhaps the temptation to be the first to strike makes the situation more agrivated??

I don't know the solution. In the case of these pair of sharks that were destroyed, perhaps nothing has really been achieved but it definitely gives me a little warm fuzzy feeling that there is a very small percentage less now & it was a win for the WA water user to see them gone IMO...

Boon

hezzy's picture

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[You would think they would

Fri, 2014-10-10 12:47

[You would think they would be like any other species in the ocean where its survival of the fittest. If you have two sharks bypass a human perhaps the temptation to be the first to strike makes the situation more agrivated??]

possibility is also if those GW are having to fight or rush in to be the first one to grab the tuna [whatever ]bait that cage dive operaters use to lure them up and keep them in close view at the boats side
possible conditioning is going on , sharks learn to rush in , maybe there losing there natural caution in those types of encounters that involve interation with humans /boats on the water ?

they have learnt distinct tecniques to hunt in the natural enviroment , this may be an adaption ?

hezzy

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I think your last statement is quite valid

Fri, 2014-10-10 17:47

I think you have a very valid point Hezzy.

timboon's picture

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Unfortunately the longer the

Fri, 2014-10-10 22:13

Unfortunately the longer the cage diving goes on the more of a backlash there will continue to be while attack rates go up as we don't have too much else to blame along with protection of the species.

If the Ab divers who use similar alli cages cant get this stopped then I don't think the general public can. Perhaps we need to get the Greens on side. Cant beat em, joing em?

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  If you dont want to get

Sat, 2014-10-11 17:37

 If you dont want to get eaten by a shark stay out of their back yard - especially at feeding time. And dont dress up like a seal.

 

 

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little johnny's picture

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fletch72

Sat, 2014-10-11 23:31

I hope you don't drive a car .stay off the road , what a prick off a comment,show some compassion for the guy and his family , another person who doesn't eat meat or fish or use toilet paper,you are a d--k.sorry adam love site ,held my tounge many times,nothing wrong with surfing,diving or fishing ,I may get kicked off site after this but you are a f--k he-d.i pray nothing happens bad to anyone on site water or road, can happen anywhere , iam sure family doesnt need f---ed comments like this twat did.sorry once again but this gets me going its always the persons fault for enjoying himself ,fletch72 you are out off line, no dought you are a parent like myself.or back to the start of 7th line,f--k he-d.

Colt_Striker's picture

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Well put John

Sun, 2014-10-12 06:55

 Quite restrained as well

timboon's picture

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Hmmm Adam I vote Johnny stays

Sun, 2014-10-12 02:21

Hmmm Adam I vote Johnny stays :)

Johnny I can listen to valid points that guys like Fausto make as everyone is entitled to their opinion but your right, when dickheads start using comparisons between cars, dogs, sex toys etc it turns this debate into bullshit...

Roo's are culled
Magpies are shot
Crocs are hunted down
Dingos are culled
Dogs are shot
Snakes are run over & shot
Ducks are culled
Camels are culled
Donkeys culled
Pigs goats rabbits blah farking blah

But we have to feel sorry for a Shark that has bitten someone in half & it means we all should stay out of the water or wear a Megladon outfit to trick em....

Far cough Fletch!!

Oh and on that note Fletch I don't really think you have the right to launch your boat and enjoy the ocean, Its the sharks backyard right... I catch you in my back yard and you'll have an air rifle pellet up the clacker, so using your theory perhaps you best stay out of their yard unless your granted permission by papa shark...

No fishing for you means we'll have the pleasure of listening to your insightful comments on here more I guess.

uncle's picture

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Well said Johny

Sun, 2014-10-12 06:21

 What a troll fletch is

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terboz123's picture

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 good constructive read this

Sun, 2014-10-12 05:23

 good constructive read this thread......

 

but fletch..seriously. your head ought to be hanging your head low.

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uncle's picture

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What a nightmare for the guys down south

Sun, 2014-10-12 06:24

 In the blow up boat!! Scared shitless I bet

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sea-kem's picture

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 Just read that article Unc,

Sun, 2014-10-12 07:41

 Just read that article Unc, Jesus Christ! That's the kind of thing to make you sell your boat and take up knitting.

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Dale's picture

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 Yeah, they were a little

Sun, 2014-10-12 07:45

 Yeah, they were a little lucky I think. They woulda been puckering.

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Hate mail

Mon, 2014-10-13 11:29

I wouldnt go blaming those hate mails on greenies completely. ok there may be some doing that but the truth of the matter is that those hate mails are from some little fat kid or an outcast teenager that stays home coz he gets beaten up at parties and never gets laid. typical troll comments. I think anyone with half a brain regardless what side of the fence would want the guy to get better and feel for him n family. anytime something with such big media attention comes out and controversial, there is some f wits out there who troll them.
just like when young kids commit suicide because of bullying and the you get trolls who put messages up on facebook berating them etc. they think they are tough because no one can see them. you find out who they are and it is usually someone like i mentioned above. you confront these people face to face and they s..t their pants, because they are weak little scum.

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Give me a fish and I will eat for a day, teach me to fish and I will starve to death.

little johnny's picture

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agree u are right

Mon, 2014-10-13 21:38

cant blame the greenies,at all fausto 79 .I was out of line with that 1 comment,i lost one of my best mate ever many years ago( my brother) I know what my mum & dad went through.(living hell),my point I was trying to get to was show some compassion ,for the guys friends,girl friend and family. If any member took offence to my comments I am sorry .sometimes I do take things to far,but no one can blame people for enjoying there life, no matter what they do .can happen anytime to anyone anywhere,

uncle's picture

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don't sweat it Johnny

Tue, 2014-10-14 08:27

you were right on in your comments

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 jeez Fletch, you arrived in

Mon, 2014-10-13 16:24

 jeez Fletch, you arrived in Australia as an immigrant a little over a year ago, came on here asking for help fishing etc.

Now after a year feeling empowered enough to lecture "the locals" on lifestyle and choices?

I also wasnt born here but I dont think it took me 12 months to realize its not welcome, just as it wouldnt be in the UK-no matter whether you're right or wrong!

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 Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...

 

 

The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.

Everyone's just winging it.

 

timboon's picture

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Yo Fletch how unlucky was

Mon, 2014-10-13 21:08

Yo Fletch how unlucky was that shark in Geograph!! 3 dudes dressed as a seal driving that kayak straight into the poor things open mouth!!

Kayakers should be culled!!

I hope the shark recovers well...